Common Core

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Re: Common Core

Postby surfsteve » Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:42 am

Haven't watched this video yet but the speakers were mentioned in the last video I posted so I am interested to hear their views and what they have to say.
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Re: Common Core

Postby wildrose » Wed Jan 21, 2015 9:38 am

Actually curriculum specialists representing almost all of the states were involved in the development of the Common Core State Standards. Despite all the hysterics over the standards, they aren't all that different from curriculum frameworks that have been used for decades across the USA. The only real difference is that CCSS is meant to make the education received by students across the country more uniform. An advantage of this is that kids who move often will be able to keep going where they left off when they have to change schools.
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Re: Common Core

Postby surfsteve » Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:42 pm

Seems like the whole last video was about two people testifying how everyone's input was ignored and that their committee was used to rubber stamp what's been developed by the Gates Foundation. It is my understanding that they are charging a fortune for developing curriculum; this is much more than open office vs microsoft office, or Linux vs Windows. Is it really a good idea for BlueScreen Bill to be in charge of education? There wont merely be a back door to infect your computer anymore; there will be a back door right into your childrens minds. This wasn't something that was openly developed and reported on, it was developed in secrecy and pushed through; virtually nobody heard of Common Core till it was already in place.

You are right though, common corps is the same stuff, in a different day, to a much different degree:
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Re: Common Core

Postby wildrose » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:49 am

surfsteve: Nice post! I think that there's a lot of truth in what Chomsky is saying, especially about public education at the lower levels. I'm not so sure if I agree with what he says about education at the university level. When I was in college we were always encouraged to question assumptions and assertions made in textbooks. We analyzed the results of various studies and professors were always eager to debunk claims made in the results and conclusions portions of the study reports. I do believe that bureaucrats prefer curriculum which encourages conforming to their ideological standards, but by in large most teachers have values which are in conflict with those ideological standards and so teachers tend to undermine the programs imposed by bureaucrats. Common Core is quite a departure from NCLB and while I believe NCLB was created to impose pressure to conform, Common Core is quite the opposite.
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Re: Common Core

Postby MojaveMike » Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:31 am

Chomsky is right in some ways, but he's dead wrong in other ways. At the university level creative thinking in all areas is encouraged. Whether you're talking humanities, social science, or hard science, college students are encouraged to question everything and not to just accept the status quo or to regurgitate facts. However, education before college in the USA is a two tiered system. It's not intended to be that way, but it is a de facto two tiered system nonetheless. Public schools in affluent communities do a good job teaching critical thinking, creative problem solving, and all the great stuff that we would like schools to do. Schools in less affluent neighborhoods tend to teach static facts and tend not to be intellectually stimulating. The reason for this is that students from affluent families tend to come to school eager to learn and they cooperate with teachers and so teachers can do more for them since they are not constantly dealing with behavior issues. Kids from less affluent areas sabotage their own education. None of this is by design. It's just the way things work out as a result of social dynamics. I'm sorry that I can't recall the names of any of the articles I read on this, but when you think about it, it stands to reason. Curriculum just provides a basic structure. It's what actually goes on in the classroom that counts.
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Re: Common Core

Postby surfsteve » Thu Jan 22, 2015 12:07 pm

I honestly don't feel Common Core is the opposite of NCLB in that it encourages people not to conform. It almost seems to take conformity to a whole new level, at least when it comes to swallowing the material; the non conformity I'm getting seems to be directed outward; to manipulate parents or anyone outside of the system.

Conformity isn't even an issue, in the following article; when it comes to the differences between Common Core and NCLB.

7 Major Differences between No Child Left Behind and Common Core/Race to the Top
http://pioneerinstitute.org/blog/7-majo ... o-the-top/


The title of this 2nd article says it all.
Common Core Standards = No Child Left Behind on Steroids
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Re: Common Core

Postby wildrose » Fri Jan 23, 2015 8:48 am

surfsteve: Common Core does not specify an assessment tool. Common Core is just curriculum and as far as curriculum goes it does a great job of fostering critical thinking skills, collaboration, and creativity. Now assessment is another thing altogether and that's where you might get some negative influence. However, everything I've heard is that NCLB put a lot of pressure on teachers because it stressed assessment above curriculum and from that point of view Common Core is pretty much the opposite of NCLB. Of course, being a retired school teacher I don't follow any of this as closely as I did while I was still active in the classroom.
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Re: Common Core

Postby surfsteve » Sat Jan 24, 2015 8:50 am

Perhaps I'm not following you correctly. Aren't the tests the tool used to access how the students are doing? What other way is there?
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Re: Common Core

Postby wildrose » Sat Jan 24, 2015 9:50 am

surfsteve: Common Core is about curriculum. The assessment tool is not specified in Common Core. However, any assessment tool used is supposed to test for concepts and skills contained in whatever curriculum is being used. To test for concepts and skills not contained in the curriculum would be an odd thing to do. It sounds like your beef is with standardized testing in general and not with Common Core. Testing companies create the testing instruments and they are supposed to align the testing instruments with what is being taught in classrooms. I know the new tests are administered online using computers, but I retired before they started doing that and so I've just heard about that from friends and colleagues still in the classroom. I'm not a big fan of standardized testing either, but bureaucrats insist on holding schools accountable and they believe that the data generated by standardized tests provides an accurate measure of how much students are learning. BTW, how would you measure the effectiveness of schools? Or would you just not worry about it and trust teachers to do their jobs?
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Re: Common Core

Postby surfsteve » Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:27 pm

I'm still not understanding your point. I would measure the effectiveness of schools by the long term success, health and happiness of it's students. But then I'm not a bureaucrat. Perhaps if I were I would wonder why they don't make me give more of the peoples money to the schools that parents elect their children to attend and allow all the crappy schools to go out of business; instead of whoever gives my boss the most contributions. How long do you think I would last at my job?
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